Dirt cheap gen 3 3SGE: To buy or not to buy?

Cool Ace, none of us has much exerience with gen3/4 etc.

This motor is better suited to a kitcar or rwd car, I'd like to know what they did with the distributor as I've seen some strange
ideas over the years.

 

That must be what I've been thinking of. I knew Gen1/2 manis were interchangable and I also knew Gen3/4 were interchangable. I also knew that on the exhaust side Gen4 upgrades were limited to products conceived for the Gen3. But for some reason I thought the stud pattern on the intake side was the same across all four. Maybe it is and its just the ports that don't match.....either way, thanks for setting me straight on that.

I have a Caldina engine waiting to be installed on one of my ST165s so I'm glad I didn't learn this the hard way. Could've caused me a minor headache.

 

here to help

 

I've done quite a bit of research on the 4th gen 3sgte. For the most part the 3rd/4th gens share the same stuff. The only thing they really don't share is the intake. IIRC the porting was changed to the 4th gen to help that lean issue that was ever so present in the previous gen's due to the TMIC and center feed.

 

The porting is the same, just the plenum which is side feed. The caldina head also lacks provision for the dizzy, the in cam has a cas trigger and the cas is on the intake side of the head.

Also pump and sump are same as beams, with crank angle sensor. Also weak rods. Also caldina scores the gen3 top feed fuel rail.

 

Yes the rods are weaker, however they're able to handle the stock boost levels of the st215 motor (low 20's if I remember right). I'm running mine all stock and have easily boosted to 15 without any issues. It's when you're going OVER stock boost levels that you need to look to upgrading the rods first.

 

Agreed on the rods, this is what can happen over 15psi with stock internals
This was an attempt at 20psi

 

the rods are weaker than gen3 items. they may or may not bend if you increase the boost, it's just that if for some reason you get more detonation than you were hoping for at some point the rods are less forgiving/able to with stand the increased stresses.

all 3sg(T)e motors are fine within their stock power levels. once you start modding etc then inherent weakness are shown, like the gen2/3 center feed manifold design leaning out cyls 2/3, also the risk of bores cracking on all 3s blocks if you push the HP and bore to 87mm pistons etc.

 

Question:
Is the gen2 GTE cambelt idler tensioner and spring tensioner the same as on the gen3 heads
My heads didn't come with them and the BGB pics (drawings) look the same?
Neither the gen1 or gen2 GE cambelt covers will work without some cutting

Pics would be a great help

Ya, people thought I was joking when I advised them NOT to turbo the 3S-5S motors.
Here's the FE rod compared to the GE, the gen3 on seems to have a more triangular base but there's nothing to stop buckling under detonation?

 

no, gen2/3 hyd tensioners aren't the same. almost but not quite. the gen3 timing belt is 1 tooth longer, the idle bearing and tesioner bracket assembl is also a little different.

new hyd tensioners are only $60NZ last time i checked anyhow, always best to go new with a rebuilt engine.

part number for gen3 ge/gte are the same. very rare for them to bend/snap, but they are heavy, don't do your bearings any favors if your fitting larger cams and revving hard on regular occasions.

 

Shart - I'll have to do more research & digging, GTE g2 parts are scarce here.
There was a ST185 in the yards a year ago, shoulda grabbed everything but as usual the money tree was bare

 

yeh, they are close but not close enough. i have some spare gen2 hyd tensioners, but as said, they aren't exp new

 

you could use the bottom end and fit your gen1 head if the bottom end was in good nick etc.

i'm not sure whats going on with that motor, but it has the gen1/2 sump fitted and oilcooler on the block.

it's possible it's just a gen3 head on a gen1/2 block.

if the bottom end is nothing fancy then (ie not gen2/3 with higher comp pistons) then no real gain from using it.

 

Except the ease of transfering this to that.

Let me be clear, Thai. This is not the engine you want or need. But just for the sake of education, if you were to use a Gen 3 head you'd have far more aftermarket support for increasing horsepower. And since it's already connected to the bottom end you'd might as well use that. But I'm afraid the amount of parts you need to make this work make this too complex a project.

Buy this:http://www.ebay.com/itm/Toyota-Celi...Parts_Accessories&hash=item51a087f351&vxp=mtr

It has the famed E56 LSD Gorilla box.....

 

yes but if it's been bodged and they've fitted a gen3 head to an old gen1 block, chances are it's not worth spending the time fitting it into another vehicle.

when you come across frankenstien motors with used bottom ends from diff gen's etc (this may or may not have been rebuilt) then chances are the person that did it was on a budget and cut cost where he could, leaving a motor that one should avoid.

 

Thanks for the info
I have gen2 & 3 tensioner bearing brackets now, they are different with the Gen 3 having provision for a spring.
The tensioners in the pic must be from a Gen 3? (mine has a different bolt pattern) I did get a used Gen 2 tensioner which even in a vice is stiff as phuk? Is that correct.
Looking at these tensioners I think I'm going to ditch it and make a slotted alu plate where I can set the tension manually.
What do you guys think?